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The Post Office’s IT helpdesk was instructing Fujitsu, the maker of faulty accounting software, to change sub-postmaster accounts more than a decade ago, according to leaked recordings.

Two secret audio recordings with Post Office officials, obtained by Sky News, demonstrate how much the government-owned company knew about flaws with the Horizon IT programme, used by sub-postmasters to record branch transactions.

Hundreds were prosecuted for theft and false accounting and many more borrowed large amounts, lost homes, and moved from their areas after incorrect shortfalls were generated by Horizon.

Forensic accountants Second Sight was examining issues with Horizon in 2013, two years before the Post Office stopped using the software data to prosecute sub-postmasters.

‘Fujitsu tells Post Office: We will change the balances’

Those forensic accountants uncovered emails from the Post Office to Fujitsu, they said in leaked calls in May 2013.

Ian Henderson of Second Sight said: “What we’re seeing from the emails is [Fujitsu] were getting instructions, in effect, directly from the helpdesk saying, ‘Look, we need this fixed. You know, can you work your magic?’ and the responses are going back, ‘Yeah, it will be done in the overnight run tonight. We will change the balances or whatever’.”

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On that call were the Post Office’s chief lawyer Susan Crichton and company secretary Alwen Lyons, as well as another Second Sight forensic accountant Ron Warmington.

Specific dates, times and places Fujitsu made ‘corrections’

At that time, Second Sight had already found specific dates, times, and branches where Fujitsu made “corrections” or “adjustments” to sub-postmaster accounts, Mr Henderson told a Post Office IT staff member on a separate tape.

“We have identified some very specific dates and times and, indeed, branches where this capability [to alter accounts] is alleged to have been used,” he said.

Fujitsu UK head office in Bracknell
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File pic: PA

Read more:
More than £1m claimed as Post Office ‘profit’ may have come from sub-postmasters
Post Office to be removed from Horizon compensation process, minister says

Concerns over an alleged Post Office testing facility at Fujitsu were raised by Post Office chief lawyer Susan Crichton in her recorded conversation with Second Sight. “Maybe, you know, it is the case that that exists,” she said.

Mr Henderson of Second Sight wanted the focus to remain on the Post Office.

“Well, remember it was [Post Office Limited] employees. They just happened to be located in a Fujitsu building. I don’t think we can sort of pass the blame on to Fujitsu,” he said.

A ‘difficult few years’ ahead

Fujitsu was being updated on Second Sight’s findings and was “getting nervous about the whole thing”, Mr Henderson said. “I am picking up some vibes along those lines.”

Ms Crichton said in response that this information should be included in an email from Second Sight to Post Office officials.

She was bracing for a tough time with Fujitsu. “We have got a difficult few years with them, I think.”

Post Office delays that slowed the investigation

Second Sight was already facing difficulties in its investigation due, in part, to delays at the Post Office.

Some Horizon data was “thin on the ground”, Second Sight forensic accountant Ron Warmington said, which meant it couldn’t complete inquiries into instances where sub-postmasters said Horizon didn’t work properly.

Mr Warmington said: “We have documented what the sub-postmaster says – asserts, and validated as best we can without looking at the Horizon data, and submitted it, but that we haven’t yet got a response from Post Office Limited and/or we haven’t got the underlying data yet to validate or refute the assertion.”

Replies from the Post Office sometimes took six weeks, Mr Henderson of Second Sight told Post Office chief lawyer Ms Crichton.

“Also, frankly, we could be a lot more aggressive in terms of bringing to your attention delays in the system when we’ve
bashed something out and it takes six weeks for a substantive reply to come back.”

“Yeah, you need to be shouting to me,” Ms Crichton said.

Second Sight’s contract was eventually terminated by the Post Office in 2015 before their work could be completed.

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Fresh questions for Post Office

New pressure on Paula Vennells

The tapes also show the extent of Paula Vennells, the Post Office’s former chief executive’s knowledge of Horizon’s failings, six years before the organisation acknowledged wrongdoing in 2019 and apologised as part of sub-postmaster victims’ successful High Court challenge.

Officials said on the tapes they were updating Ms Vennells. “The way that I’ve tried to brief Paula is as soon as I have evidence that, you know, there is a problem she knows about it the next minute”, company secretary Alwen Lyons said.

Post Office CEO Paula Vennells, in 2018
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Paula Vennells in 2018. Pic: Rex

Two years on from the date of the tape calls, Ms Vennells told the MPs of the Business and Trade Committee that remote access to Horizon was not possible. Such denials were used in the court case against sub-postmasters.

Today that committee said all options are on the table, including holding Ms Vennells in contempt of parliament.

“We are deeply concerned by the latest revelations regarding the Post Office and will be exploring options for penalising the leadership that presided over the scandal,” Business and Trade Committee Liam Byrne said.

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In response to Sky News’s reporting, Ms Vennells said: “I continue to support and focus on co-operating with the inquiry and expect to be giving evidence in the coming months.

“I am truly sorry for the devastation caused to the sub-postmasters and their families, whose lives were torn apart by being wrongly accused and wrongly prosecuted as a result of the Horizon system.

“I now intend to continue to focus on assisting the inquiry and will not make any further public comment until it has concluded.”

A Post Office spokesperson said: “We remain fully focused on getting to the truth of what happened and supporting the statutory Public Inquiry, which is chaired by a judge with the power to question witnesses under oath, and is therefore best placed to achieve this.”

Fujitsu said it does not wish to comment.

Alwen Lyons and Susan Crichton did not respond to requests for comment.

Additional reporting by Emily Jennings, business producer.

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Council finances are becoming unsustainable and whole system overhaul is required, watchdog warns

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Council finances are becoming unsustainable and whole system overhaul is required, watchdog warns

From bin collections and parks to social care, it’s estimated local authorities in England provide more than 800 services for residents, touching on many different aspects of our lives all the way from childhood to elderly care.

A National Audit Office report found spending on services increased by £12.8bn – from £60bn to £72.8bn – between 2015-16 and 2023-24, a 21% increase in real terms.

Most of this increased spending – £10.3bn – has gone to adult and children’s social care, which represents councils’ biggest spend, increasing as a share of overall spending from 53% to 58% over the period.

Previous central funding cuts and an increasing population mean that spending power per person has largely stagnated, however, and remains 1% lower per person than in 2015/16, the report said.

This is a measure of the funding available to local authorities from central government grants, council tax and business rates. Though grant funding has increased in recent years, it has not yet made up for pre-2020 government cuts.

Complex needs

The population in England has increased by 5% over the period, accounting for some of this increased pressure, but it’s not the only driver.

In many areas, demand has outpaced population growth, as external events and the complexity of people’s needs has shifted over time.

The rapid increase in costs of temporary accommodation, for example, has been driven by the large increases in people facing homelessness because of inflationary pressures and housing shortages.

At the same time, demand for new adult social care plans has increased by 15%.

As life expectancies have increased, the length of time in people’s lives during which they suffer from health problems has also increased.

“We see that in adult social care that people have multiple conditions and need more and more support and often will be appearing as if they’re frailer at an earlier age. So that’s an important trend,” explained Melanie Williams, president of the Association of Directors of Adult Social Services.

“We’re constantly focusing on most urgent things at the expense of not doing the preventative work,” she added.

“When we’re just focusing on getting people home from hospital, we’re not doing that piece of work to enable them not to go there in the first place.”

Budget cliff edge over SEND spending

Meanwhile, demand for education, health and care (EHC) plans, for children with more complex special educational support needs has more than doubled, increasing by 140% to 576,000.

Budgets for special educational needs and disabilities (SEND) have not kept pace, meaning local authority spending has consistently outstripped government funding, leading to substantial deficits in council budgets.

Most authorities with responsibilities for SEND have overspent their budget as they have been allowed to until March 2026 on a temporary override, but they will need to draw on their own reserves to make these payments in a year.

One in three councils will have deficits that they can’t cover when the override ends.

Cuts to services

In the latest figures for 2023/24, the NAO found £3 in every £5 of services spending by English local authorities went towards social care and education, totalling £42.3bn.

This has left little headroom for other services, many of which have experienced real-terms financial cuts over the same time period, with councils forced to identify other services like libraries, parks and the arts to make savings.

But, Williams warned, cultural and environmental services like these can play a vital role in wellbeing and may actually exacerbate demand for social care.

“For us to be able to safeguard both adults and children – so people that need extra support – we do need that wider bit for councils to do,” said Williams, who also serves as corporate director of adult social care for Nottingham County Council.

“It’s no good me just providing care and support if somebody can’t go out and access a park, or go out and access leisure, or go out and have that wider support in the community.”

Commenting on the report, Cllr Tim Oliver, chairman of the County Councils Network, said: “As we have warned, councils have little choice but to spend more and more on the most demand-intensive services, at the expense of everything else – leaving them providing little more than care services.

“It is market-specific cost pressures, mainly in adult social care, children’s services, and special educational needs, that are driving councils’ costs rather than deprivation. Therefore government must recognise and address these pressures in its fair funding review, otherwise it will push many well-run councils to the brink.”

Fighting fires

The NAO report describes a vicious cycle where councils’ limited budgets have resulted in a focus on reactive care addressing the most urgent needs.

More efficient preventative care that could lower demand in the long term has fallen to the wayside.

In one example cited by the NAO, the Public Health Grant, which funds preventative health services, is expected to fall in real terms by £846m (20.1%) between 2015/16 and 2024/25.

Other areas have seen a switch in funding from prevention to late intervention.

Councils’ funding towards homelessness support services increased by £1.57bn between 2015/16 and 2013/24, while money for preventative and other housing services fell by £0.64bn.

Financing overhaul needed

Since 2018, seven councils have issued section 114 notices, which indicate that a council’s planned spending will breach the Local Government Finance Act when the local authority believes it’s become unable to balance its budget.

And 42 local authorities have received over £5bn of support through the Exceptional Financial Support (EFS) framework since its introduction in 2020.

According to a recent Local Government Association survey referenced in the NAO report, up to 44% of councils believe they’ll have to issue a section 114 notice within the next two years should the UK government cease providing exceptional financial support.

Read more:
Councils to get £68m to build thousands of homes
Council tax to rise to pay for police funding increase
Councils to receive £1bn boost to tackle homelessness

Looking ahead to upcoming funding settlements, and the government’s planned reforms of local government, the NAO warns that short-term measures to address acute funding shortfalls have not addressed the systemic weaknesses in the funding model, with a whole system overhaul required.

Sir Geoffrey Clifton-Brown, chair of the Committee of Public Accounts, said: “Short-term support is a sticking plaster to the underlying pressures facing local authorities. Delays in local audits are further undermining public confidence in local government finances.

“There needs to be a cross-government approach to local government finance reform, which must deliver effective accountability and value for money for taxpayers.”


The Data and Forensics team is a multi-skilled unit dedicated to providing transparent journalism from Sky News. We gather, analyse and visualise data to tell data-driven stories. We combine traditional reporting skills with advanced analysis of satellite images, social media and other open-source information. Through multimedia storytelling we aim to better explain the world while also showing how our journalism is done.

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Victims of second Post Office scandal criticise ‘grinding wheels of bureaucracy’ as they try to get compensation

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Victims of second Post Office scandal criticise 'grinding wheels of bureaucracy' as they try to get compensation

Victims of ‘Capture’, a second faulty Post Office accounting system, say their redress scheme may not be in place until the autumn.

Former sub-postmasters and their relatives met with government representatives for an update on compensation.

While lawyers describe “positive steps”, some victims have told Sky News that they are disappointed with the timescale and described coming up against the “grinding wheels of bureaucracy”.

Capture software was an accounting system rolled out in Post Office branches between 1992 and 1999 and was likely to have caused false shortfalls.

It was the predecessor to Horizon, which led to hundreds of sub-postmasters being wrongly convicted of stealing between 1999 and 2015.

Former sub-postmaster Lee Bowerman, who was never accused of stealing but had to sell his Post Office business after using Capture, said the meeting was a “damp squib” and criticised “the grinding wheels of bureaucracy”.

He agreed that the proposed redress scheme would be “quicker than Horizon” but added “you can’t use them as a yardstick because at the end of the day …people still haven’t been paid out”.

Mr Bowerman added: “So don’t compare us to them when those schemes aren’t even fit for purpose.”

Around 100 Capture victims so far could be eligible for redress.

The scheme, however, would not apply to anyone currently convicted.

The Criminal Cases Review Commission (CCRC) have confirmed that they are now reviewing 27 Capture convictions.

Victims were told the government is considering a separate “fast track” redress scheme for anyone who has their conviction overturned in the future.

Lee Bowerman had to sell his Post Office business after using Capture
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Lee Bowerman had to sell his Post Office business after using Capture

Steve Marston’s case is among those being considered after he was convicted of stealing from his branch in 1996 following shortfalls of nearly £80,000.

“I don’t think it would be human nature not to be disappointed that [the redress scheme] is not being sorted out in the next couple of days even,” he said.

“But we are talking about the government, aren’t we? They’ve got to fill in a form in triplicate, get it rubber stamped three times and that’s for a box of paper clips,” he added.

“I mean it is what it is, we have got to roll with it, stick in there and keep pushing as much as we can”.

Clare Brennan, daughter of Peter Lloyd-Halt, who was a sub-postmaster accused of stealing whilst using Capture, said she and her mother Agnes found the meeting “positive”.

She went on to describe a “weight being lifted” after they were told that it had been officially recognised that Mr Lloyd-Halt had worked for the Post Office.

The family say all Mr Lloyd-Halt’s documents and evidence have been lost and it’s been a challenge to their case.

Lawyers for victims also described “positive steps” towards a new compensation scheme, following the government meeting.

Read more:
Sub-postmasters ‘still going through hell’
What is the Horizon Post Office scandal?

Agnes Lloyd-Holt and Clare Brennan
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Agnes Lloyd-Holt and Clare Brennan

Neil Hudgell, of Hudgell Solicitors, said that they were “reassured by the Department for Business and Trade today that good progress is being made with learnings taken from previous Post Office compensation schemes to form this one”.

He added that “there is a clear willingness to do right by those who have suffered at the hands of the Post Office in relation to Capture”.

“We always appreciate that redress can never come quick enough for these victims and we push as much as we can to take things forward.”

A spokesperson from the Department for Business and Trade said: “Officials met with postmasters today as part of the government’s commitment to develop an effective and fair redress process that takes into account the circumstances of those affected by Capture.

“Ensuring postmasters are treated with dignity and respect is our absolute priority and we will continue to update on the development of the redress mechanism as it progresses.”

The next meeting with Capture victims is due in April.

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Gatwick second runway decision deadline is extended on green concerns

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Gatwick second runway decision deadline is extended on green concerns

The government has signalled that plans to bring a second runway at Gatwick into regular use will get the green light if environmental conditions are met.

Transport Secretary Heidi Alexander said she was “minded to approve” the airport’s plans but the deadline for a decision had now been pushed back until the end of October.

The main stumbling blocks facing Gatwick’s proposals are related to its provisions for noise prevention and public transport.

The Planning Inspectorate had made recommendations in those two areas after initially rejecting the scheme.

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The airport welcomed the government’s statement but did not say whether it saw a need to adjust its plans to meet the conditions.

Gatwick has until April 24 to respond to the new proposals.

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The northern runway already exists at the airport parallel to the main one, but cannot be used at the same time as it is too close.

It is currently limited to being a taxiway and only used for take-offs and landings if the main one has to shut.

Gatwick wants to move it 12 metres further away to solve this problem.

A view of the Northern Runway, after a press conference at the South Terminal of Gatwick Airport, West Sussex, to discuss plans to use the airport's emergency runway for routine flights. Picture date: Wednesday August 25, 2021.
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The northern runway is currently only used for emergencies or where the main one is closed. Pic: PA

It says being able to run both at the same time would allow around 100,000 more flights per year and create 14,000 jobs.

Gatwick says the £2.2bn project would not need government money, would be 100% privately funded, and could be complete by the end of the decade.

The airport is already the second busiest in the UK, and the busiest single runway airport in Europe.

Campaigners argue the additional traffic would be catastrophic for the environment and the local community in particular.

Today’s update comes after the chancellor said last month the government also supported a third runway at Heathrow as part of its wider effort to bolster UK economic growth.

However, the formal planning process is still to take place.

Gatwick’s additional runway would be unlikely to open until the end of the decade, assuming any legal challenges were swiftly overcome.

A government source told Sky News: “The transport secretary has set out a path to approving the expansion of Gatwick today following the Planning Inspectorate’s recommendation to refuse the original application.

“This is an important step forward and demonstrates that this government will stop at nothing to deliver economic growth and new infrastructure as part of our Plan for Change.

“Expansion will bring huge benefits for business and represents a victory for holidaymakers. We want to deliver this opportunity in line with our legal, environmental and climate obligations.

“We look forward to Gatwick’s response as they have indicated planes could take off from a new runway before the end of this Parliament.”

Stewart Wingate, Gatwick’s chief executive, said: “We welcome today’s announcement that the Secretary of State for Transport is minded to approve our Northern Runway plans and has outlined a clear pathway to full approval later in the year.

“It is vital that any planning conditions attached to the final approval enable us to make a decision to invest £2.2bn in this project and realise the full benefits of bringing the Northern Runway into routine use.

“We will of course engage fully in the extended process for a final decision.”

He added: “We stand ready to deliver this project which will create 14,000 jobs and generate £1bn a year in economic benefits. By increasing resilience and capacity we can support the UK’s position as a leader in global connectivity and deliver substantial trade and economic growth in the South East and more broadly.

“We have also outlined to government how we plan to grow responsibly to meet increasing passenger demand, while minimising noise and environmental impacts.”

A spokesperson for campaign group Communities Against Gatwick Noise Emissions (Cagne) responded: “We welcome the extension by the secretary of state until October as she has obviously recognised the many holes in the Gatwick airport submissions during the planning hearings.

“Cagne do not believe Gatwick has been totally up front with their submissions, and the planning hearings left so many questions unanswered.”

Greenpeace UK’s policy director, Doug Parr, said of the process ahead: “By approving Gatwick’s expansion the government will hang a millstone the size of a 747 around the country’s neck.

“Such a decision would be one that smacks of desperation, completely ignoring the solid evidence that increasing air travel won’t drive economic growth. The only thing it’s set to boost is air pollution, noise, and climate emissions.”

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