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The Post Office’s IT helpdesk was instructing Fujitsu, the maker of faulty accounting software, to change sub-postmaster accounts more than a decade ago, according to leaked recordings.

Two secret audio recordings with Post Office officials, obtained by Sky News, demonstrate how much the government-owned company knew about flaws with the Horizon IT programme, used by sub-postmasters to record branch transactions.

Hundreds were prosecuted for theft and false accounting and many more borrowed large amounts, lost homes, and moved from their areas after incorrect shortfalls were generated by Horizon.

Forensic accountants Second Sight was examining issues with Horizon in 2013, two years before the Post Office stopped using the software data to prosecute sub-postmasters.

‘Fujitsu tells Post Office: We will change the balances’

Those forensic accountants uncovered emails from the Post Office to Fujitsu, they said in leaked calls in May 2013.

Ian Henderson of Second Sight said: “What we’re seeing from the emails is [Fujitsu] were getting instructions, in effect, directly from the helpdesk saying, ‘Look, we need this fixed. You know, can you work your magic?’ and the responses are going back, ‘Yeah, it will be done in the overnight run tonight. We will change the balances or whatever’.”

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On that call were the Post Office’s chief lawyer Susan Crichton and company secretary Alwen Lyons, as well as another Second Sight forensic accountant Ron Warmington.

Specific dates, times and places Fujitsu made ‘corrections’

At that time, Second Sight had already found specific dates, times, and branches where Fujitsu made “corrections” or “adjustments” to sub-postmaster accounts, Mr Henderson told a Post Office IT staff member on a separate tape.

“We have identified some very specific dates and times and, indeed, branches where this capability [to alter accounts] is alleged to have been used,” he said.

Fujitsu UK head office in Bracknell
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File pic: PA

Read more:
More than £1m claimed as Post Office ‘profit’ may have come from sub-postmasters
Post Office to be removed from Horizon compensation process, minister says

Concerns over an alleged Post Office testing facility at Fujitsu were raised by Post Office chief lawyer Susan Crichton in her recorded conversation with Second Sight. “Maybe, you know, it is the case that that exists,” she said.

Mr Henderson of Second Sight wanted the focus to remain on the Post Office.

“Well, remember it was [Post Office Limited] employees. They just happened to be located in a Fujitsu building. I don’t think we can sort of pass the blame on to Fujitsu,” he said.

A ‘difficult few years’ ahead

Fujitsu was being updated on Second Sight’s findings and was “getting nervous about the whole thing”, Mr Henderson said. “I am picking up some vibes along those lines.”

Ms Crichton said in response that this information should be included in an email from Second Sight to Post Office officials.

She was bracing for a tough time with Fujitsu. “We have got a difficult few years with them, I think.”

Post Office delays that slowed the investigation

Second Sight was already facing difficulties in its investigation due, in part, to delays at the Post Office.

Some Horizon data was “thin on the ground”, Second Sight forensic accountant Ron Warmington said, which meant it couldn’t complete inquiries into instances where sub-postmasters said Horizon didn’t work properly.

Mr Warmington said: “We have documented what the sub-postmaster says – asserts, and validated as best we can without looking at the Horizon data, and submitted it, but that we haven’t yet got a response from Post Office Limited and/or we haven’t got the underlying data yet to validate or refute the assertion.”

Replies from the Post Office sometimes took six weeks, Mr Henderson of Second Sight told Post Office chief lawyer Ms Crichton.

“Also, frankly, we could be a lot more aggressive in terms of bringing to your attention delays in the system when we’ve
bashed something out and it takes six weeks for a substantive reply to come back.”

“Yeah, you need to be shouting to me,” Ms Crichton said.

Second Sight’s contract was eventually terminated by the Post Office in 2015 before their work could be completed.

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Fresh questions for Post Office

New pressure on Paula Vennells

The tapes also show the extent of Paula Vennells, the Post Office’s former chief executive’s knowledge of Horizon’s failings, six years before the organisation acknowledged wrongdoing in 2019 and apologised as part of sub-postmaster victims’ successful High Court challenge.

Officials said on the tapes they were updating Ms Vennells. “The way that I’ve tried to brief Paula is as soon as I have evidence that, you know, there is a problem she knows about it the next minute”, company secretary Alwen Lyons said.

Post Office CEO Paula Vennells, in 2018
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Paula Vennells in 2018. Pic: Rex

Two years on from the date of the tape calls, Ms Vennells told the MPs of the Business and Trade Committee that remote access to Horizon was not possible. Such denials were used in the court case against sub-postmasters.

Today that committee said all options are on the table, including holding Ms Vennells in contempt of parliament.

“We are deeply concerned by the latest revelations regarding the Post Office and will be exploring options for penalising the leadership that presided over the scandal,” Business and Trade Committee Liam Byrne said.

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In response to Sky News’s reporting, Ms Vennells said: “I continue to support and focus on co-operating with the inquiry and expect to be giving evidence in the coming months.

“I am truly sorry for the devastation caused to the sub-postmasters and their families, whose lives were torn apart by being wrongly accused and wrongly prosecuted as a result of the Horizon system.

“I now intend to continue to focus on assisting the inquiry and will not make any further public comment until it has concluded.”

A Post Office spokesperson said: “We remain fully focused on getting to the truth of what happened and supporting the statutory Public Inquiry, which is chaired by a judge with the power to question witnesses under oath, and is therefore best placed to achieve this.”

Fujitsu said it does not wish to comment.

Alwen Lyons and Susan Crichton did not respond to requests for comment.

Additional reporting by Emily Jennings, business producer.

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HSBC ‘being attacked all the time’ by online criminals – as boss ‘kept awake at night’ by cyber threat

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HSBC 'being attacked all the time' by online criminals - as boss 'kept awake at night' by cyber threat

The boss of one of the UK’s biggest banks says it is being attacked “all the time” by online criminals and he is kept up at night by cyber threats.

“It does keep me awake,” HSBC UK chief executive Ian Stuart told the Treasury Committee of MPs.

“Because we can be attacked and we are being attacked all the time.”

Money blog: ‘Highest ever’ bank switching offer launches

Mr Stuart said banks were spending “enormous” sums of hundreds of millions of pounds on IT systems – the biggest expense in their businesses.

“Cybersecurity is now very much at the top of our agenda,” he added.

Ian Stuart, chief executive of HSBC UK, appearing before the Treasury Committee. Pic: PA
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Ian Stuart, chief executive of HSBC UK, appearing before the Treasury Committee. Pic: PA

Concerns were also highlighted by Lloyds Bank chief executive Charlie Nunn, who said financial fraud will get worse if banks cannot intervene to prevent it and social media and telecoms companies are not incentivised to halt it.

Mr Nunn said the UK “has become the home of fraud”, adding that the number of victims is “pretty disturbing” and “individual cases are harrowing”.

Major high street businesses, including M&S and the Co-op, have been hit by cyber attacks in recent weeks and had their operations impacted.

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Who is behind M&S cyberattack?

Cybersecurity threats, however, were not behind the several-day outage at Barclays at the end of January, its UK chief executive Vim Maru said.

He added: “We’ve learned the lessons. We’re acting on the lessons, both work done internally, but also with help from third parties as well.

Account holders across the UK have suffered a spate of IT glitches from different banks around paydays this year.

Tens of millions of pounds on IT have been spent and customer glitches have fallen, Mr Maru said.

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Could ageing tech be behind banking outages?

He added that the problem at Barclays was a software issue, saying: “We put a fix in place that means that we won’t have a recurrence.”

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Steel tycoon Gupta in last-ditch bid to rescue UK empire

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Steel tycoon Gupta in last-ditch bid to rescue UK empire

The steel tycoon Sanjeev Gupta is mounting a last-ditch bid to salvage his British operations after seeing an emergency plea for government support rejected.

Sky News has learnt that Mr Gupta’s Liberty Speciality Steels UK (SSUK) arm is seeking to adjourn a winding-up petition scheduled to be heard in court on Wednesday.

The petition is reported to have been brought by Harsco Metals Group, a supplier of materials and labour to SSUK, and is said to be supported by other trade creditors.

Unless the adjournment is granted, Mr Gupta faces the prospect of seeing SSUK forced into compulsory liquidation.

That would raise questions over the future of roughly 1,450 more steel industry jobs, weeks after the government stepped in to rescue the larger British Steel amid a row with its Chinese owner over the future of its Scunthorpe steelworks.

If Mr Gupta’s operations do enter compulsory liquidation, the Official Receiver would appoint a special manager to run the operations while a buyer is sought.

A Whitehall insider said talks had taken place in recent days involving Mr Gupta’s executives and the Insolvency Service.

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Steel industry sources said the government could conceivably be interested in reuniting the Rotherham plant of SSUK with British Steel’s Scunthorpe site because of the industrial synergies between them, although it was unclear whether any such discussions had been held.

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Mr Gupta is said to have explored whether he could persuade the government to step in and support SSUK using the legislation enacted last month to take control of British Steel’s operations.

Whitehall insiders said, however, that Mr Gupta’s overtures had been rebuffed.

He had previously sought government aid during the pandemic but that plea was also rejected by ministers.

The SSUK division operates across sites including at Rotherham in south Yorkshire and Bolton in Lancashire.

It makes highly engineered steel products for use in sectors such as aerospace, automotive and oil and gas.

A restructuring plan due to be launched last week was abandoned at the eleventh hour after failing to secure support from creditors of Greensill, the collapsed supply chain finance provider to which Mr Gupta was closely tied.

Under that plan, creditors, including HM Revenue and Customs, would have been forced to write off a significant chunk of the money they are owed.

The company said last week that it had invested nearly £200m in the last five years into the UK steel industry, but had faced “significant challenges due to soaring energy costs and an over-reliance on cheap imports, negatively impacting the performance of all UK steel companies”.

It adds: The court’s ability to sanction the plan depended on finalisation of an agreement with creditors.

“This has not proved possible in an acceptable timeframe, and so Liberty has decided to withdraw the plan ahead of the sanction hearing on May 15 and will now quickly consider alternative options.”

One source close to Liberty Steel acknowledged that it was running out of time to salvage the business.

They said, however, that an adjournment of Wednesday’s hearing to consider the winding-up petition could yet buy the company sufficient breathing space to stitch together an alternative rescue deal.

A Liberty Steel spokesperson said on Tuesday: “Discussions continue with creditors.

“Liberty understands the concern this will create for Speciality Steel UK colleagues and remains committed to doing all it can to maintain the Speciality Steel UK business.”

The Insolvency Service and the Department for Business and Trade have also been contacted for comment.

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Daily Mail-owner Rothermere eyes minority Telegraph stake in RedBird deal

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Daily Mail-owner Rothermere eyes minority Telegraph stake in RedBird deal

The publisher of the Daily Mail has held talks in recent days about taking a minority stake in the Telegraph newspapers as part of a deal to end the two-year impasse over their ownership.

Sky News has learnt that Lord Rothermere, who controls Daily Mail & General Trust (DMGT), was in detailed negotiations late last week which would have seen him taking a 9.9% stake in the Telegraph titles.

It was unclear on Monday whether the talks were still live or whether they would result in a deal, with one adviser suggesting that the discussions may have faltered.

One insider said that if DMGT did acquire a stake in the Telegraph, the transaction would be used as a platform to explore the sharing of costs across the two companies.

They would, however, remain editorially independent.

Sources said that RedBird and IMI, whose joint venture owns a call option to convert debt secured against the Telegraph into equity, were hoping to announce a deal for the future ownership of the media group this week, potentially on Thursday.

However, the insider suggested that a transaction could yet be struck without any involvement from DMGT.

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The progress in the talks to seal new ownership for the right-leaning titles comes days after the government said it would allow foreign state investors to hold stakes of up to 15% in British national newspapers.

That would pave the way for Abu Dhabi royal family-controlled IMI to own 15% of the Daily and Sunday Telegraph – a prospect which has sparked outrage from critics including the former Spectator editor Fraser Nelson.

The decision to set the ownership threshold at 15% follows an intensive lobbying campaign by newspaper industry executives concerned that a permanent outright ban could cut off a vital source of funding to an already-embattled industry.

RedBird Capital, the US-based fund, has already said it is exploring the possibility of taking full control of the Telegraph, while IMI would have – if the status quo had been maintained – been forced to relinquish any involvement in the right-leaning broadsheets.

Other than RedBird, a number of suitors for the Telegraph have expressed interest but struggled to raise the funding for a deal.

The most notable of these has been Dovid Efune, owner of The New York Sun, who has been trying for months to raise the £550m sought by RedBird IMI to recoup its outlay.

On Sunday, the Financial Times reported that Mr Efune has secured backing from Jeremy Hosking, the prominent City investor.

Another potential offer from Todd Boehly, the Chelsea Football Club co-owner, and media tycoon David Montgomery, has failed to materialise.

RedBird IMI paid £600m in 2023 to acquire a call option that was intended to convert into ownership of the Telegraph newspapers and The Spectator magazine.

That objective was thwarted by a change in media ownership laws – which banned any form of foreign state ownership – amid an outcry from parliamentarians.

The Spectator was then sold last year for £100m to Sir Paul Marshall, the hedge fund billionaire, who has installed Lord Gove, the former cabinet minister, as its editor.

The UAE-based IMI, which is controlled by the UAE’s deputy prime minister and ultimate owner of Manchester City Football Club, Sheikh Mansour bin Zayed Al Nahyan, extended a further £600m to the Barclays to pay off a loan owed to Lloyds Banking Group, with the balance secured against other family-controlled assets.

Other bidders for the Telegraph had included Lord Saatchi, the former advertising mogul, who offered £350m, while Lord Rothermere, the Daily Mail proprietor, pulled out of the bidding for control of his rival’s titles last summer amid concerns that he would be blocked on competition grounds.

The Telegraph’s ownership had been left in limbo by a decision taken by Lloyds Banking Group, the principal lender to the Barclay family, to force some of the newspapers’ related corporate entities into a form of insolvency proceedings.

DMGT, RedBird and IMI all declined to comment.

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