Adam Boulton: Donald Trump’s cosy Carlson interview shows why carefully curated TV debates are needed on both sides of the Atlantic
Donald Trump is making a mockery of TV debates just as he has trashed so many other norms of decent behaviour and democratic politics.
He has opted out of the first two debates between the candidates vying for the Republican nomination in next year’s US presidential election.
That does not mean that he is missing out on saturation coverage in the media. Rather than appearing on stage with the people competing against him, and who mostly refuse to criticise him anyway, he sat down for a rambling interview on his own terms with the former Fox News anchor Tucker Carlson.
Trump is not the only leading politician doing his best to avoid meeting their opponents on the equal ground of a TV debate.
In the past decade, prime ministers David Cameron, Theresa May and Boris Johnson all opted out of properly organised and regulated debates.
The three leaders debates in 2010 between Gordon Brown, David Cameron and Nick Clegg, brought about by the Sky News campaign, are still the only time that British viewers have had the benefit of debates between potential PMs to match the presidential debates which have been a feature of US politics since Nixon v JFK in 1960.
Cameron, Clegg and Brown faced off against each other in the 2010 debates
America’s presidential debates have provided the model for other countries to aspire to. Now Trump is undermining that example.
2024 is set to be a double election year in the US and UK. Politicians and the media in both countries need to start considering how debates can serve the public – by informing them fairly about the democratic choices facing them – rather than contributing to the erosion of public confidence and respect for representative democracy.
Nobody can say that Trump is not media savvy. He built his public image as the boss on the US version of The Apprentice and by putting his name to ghost-written books about “The Art Of The Deal”.
His freewheeling conversation with Tucker Carlson revealed that he is as skilled as ever at manipulating the media to his own advantage.
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Trump skips Republican debate
During his interview he praised the medium he was appearing on – a pre-recorded interview released on X, formerly known as Twitter – and derided cable news.
“We will get better ratings using this crazy forum that you are using than probably the debate,” he jeered.
He rubbed further salt into the wounds of Fox News Channel – which hosted the Republican debate, which sacked Carlson, and which has been promoting alternatives to Trump – by describing Mike Wallace, Fox’s main debate moderator in the last two election cycles, as “a b***** little man”.
Wallace has since moved to CNN – a more frequent target of Trump’s animosity but which has also found it hard to resist the ratings he brings. Earlier this year there were ructions at the network leading to the departure of its CEO after it gave a platform to Trump, who appeared alone and unchallenged on a full-length TV “town hall” show.
Mainstream broadcasters are struggling to produce even-handed, non-partisan, election events. Unscrupulous candidates have an increasing number of invitations to appear on less rigorous outlets such as GB News or X instead.
Elon Musk, X’s proprietor, is trying to make it a forum for right of centre political discourse, as exemplified by his technically disastrous hosting of the Ron DeSantis campaign launch.
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Trump: ‘We did nothing wrong at all’
Trump is boycotting the debates while his rivals attack each other and winnow out the field to his advantage.
Vivek Ramaswamy, 38, was widely seen as the winner in the Fox debate, but his policies are so close to Trump’s that they hardly threaten the original.
After they failed to make an impression there seems little point in the two least known candidates, Asa Hutchinson and Doug Burgum, staying in the race.
Trump’s biggest rival Ron DeSantis turned in a lacklustre performance, as did Tim Scott. Three critics of Trump – Mike Pence, Nikki Haley, and Chris Christie – are also still notionally in contention.
Their anti-Trump stances might appeal to the wider electorate but seem certain to cost them the support of the Republican party activists who vote in the primaries.
Trump is already hailing his fourth set of criminal charges, this time in the state of Georgia, as an opportunity to boost his support among Republicans and to rake in more donations to his campaign.
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Trump mugshot released
Carlson gave Trump the chance to say what he wanted without being challenged. He gloated that he had turned the convention on its head “that when someone gets indicted their numbers go down”.
Instead “I got indicted four times” and “I’m leading by 50 or 60 points” in the Republican nomination race. “Do I sit there [in a debate]… and get harassed by people who shouldn’t even be running for president?”. His answer is no.
As his rivals grappled with each other, Trump had the chance to get in some telling blows on his ultimate rival, Joe Biden, the Democratic nominee presumptive.
“I think he’s worse mentally than he is physically, and physically he is not exactly a triathlete.”
His cruel jibes about octogenarian Biden’s state of health raise important questions about presidential debates assuming Biden and Trump are the nominees.
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The two men debated each other twice during the 2020 campaign under the auspices of the Presidential Debates Commission. A scheduled third debate was cancelled because Trump caught COVID-19.
Biden “won” both debates according to opinion polls. But Biden is now four years older and frailer. There is a danger that Trump could hijack debates between them to brutally expose Biden’s frailty – to the exclusion of all else.
Rishi Sunak and Sir Keir Starmer lack charisma but the public needs to see them debate real issues at election time
In the UK, neither Rishi Sunak nor Keir Starmer have shown any enthusiasm for election debates.
Both men lack charisma but one or other of them will be the next prime minister.
The public needs to see them debate the real issues facing the country at election time – away from the awkwardly structured Punch and Judy at PMQs.
Broadcasters and regulators should be working together to hold a single head-to-head between the two to take place during the campaign.
One debate would surely not detract from the rest of the campaign in the way that it is claimed by some that three debates did in 2010.
There are some tough issues to be faced. The debate should not be “owned” by any network but rather staged in the public interest.
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There is no need for participation by any third force. The Liberal Democrats’ electoral performance over the past decade does not justify participation and the SNP are a single-issue party, not relevant to the vast majority of UK voters and without the capacity to nominate a prime minister.
The influence of broadcast television is waning but it is still the most powerful news medium in the world.
Properly managed TV debates are still the best way to inform the wider voting public about the democratic choices before them – by watching the debates themselves and through the comment and analysis which percolates through afterwards.
Carefully curated debates on both sides of the Atlantic in 2024 would prove that broadcasters can be part of the solution rather than, inadvertently, contributing to the further degradation of democratic politics.
Donald Trump has said he “hated” to see photos of Bill Clinton in the newly released Epstein files.
The former US president was in numerous images that were released by the US Department of Justice among thousands of documents related to the late paedophile financier Jeffrey Epstein.
In his first engagement in front of the media since the release of the latest files, Mr Trump was asked about the images of Mr Clinton.
“I think it’s terrible,” Mr Trump said, adding: “I like Bill Clinton… and I hate to see photos come out of him.
“I’ve always gotten along with Bill Clinton. I’ve been nice to him, he’s been nice to me. I hate to see photos come out of him, but this is what the Democrats, mostly Democrats and a couple of bad Republicans, are asking for.
“So they are giving photos of me to. Everybody was friendly with this guy [Epstein], either friendly or not friendly.
“He was all over Palm Beach and other places… and Bill Clinton was a friend of his, but everybody was.”
Photos released of Bill Clinton included one showing him in a pool with Ghislaine Maxwell. Pics: US Department of Justice
He added: “Bill Clinton’s a big boy. He can handle it, but you probably have pictures being exposed of other people that innocently met Jeffrey Epstein years ago.”
The US president claimed the release of the files “is a way of trying to deflect from the tremendous success that the Republican Party has”.
A painting of Bill Clinton in a dress was among the images released. Pic: US DoJ
Clinton calls for release of ‘any remaining materials’
In a statement on Monday, Angel Urena, a spokesman for Mr Clinton, called for Mr Trump to “release any remaining materials referring to mentioning or containing a photograph of Bill Clinton”.
The spokesman said the materials released so far “makes it clear someone or something is being protected” but said Mr Clinton doesn’t need such protection.
“Refusal to do so will confirm the widespread suspicion the Department of Justice’s actions to date are not about transparency, but about insinuation – using selective releases to imply wrongdoing about individuals who have already been repeatedly cleared by the very same Department of Justice, over many years under presidents and attorney generals of both parties,” the spokesperson added.
The context around the photos, that were released hours before a legal deadline in the US following the passing of the Epstein Files Transparency Act, is unknown.
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The same release only features one picture with Mr Trump’s name in it.
Mr Clinton has denied any wrongdoing in connection to Epstein and says he regrets meeting him.
Backlash over release of files
It comes as other Democrats and Republicans have grown angry over the length of time it is taking the US Department of Justice to release all files in the Epstein case.
Several victims of Epstein told Sky News that the incomplete release left them feeling shocked, outraged and disappointed.
Republican representative Thomas Massie and Democratic representative Ro Khanna said they are working together on an effort to secure the release of more files, and if necessary would seek contempt of Congress charges against Attorney General Pam Bondi.
Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer also introduced legislation that would instruct Majority Leader John
Thune, a Republican, to undertake “appropriate” legal steps to gain Congress access to all the documents covered by
legislation that was passed by Congress and signed into law by Mr Trump.
It was not clear whether his effort might advance in the Senate when it returns on 5 January.
Donald Trump has announced a plan for the US Navy to build two new “Trump Class” battleships.
Aimed at cementing US naval dominance, the president said the vessels will be “the fastest, the biggest and 100 times more powerful than any battleship ever built”.
Constructed in America, made of steel and complete with missiles, guns, lasers and hypersonic weapons, the vessels will be the “centrepiece” of the US Navy’s Golden Fleet initiative, he said.
Starting with two vessels, Mr Trump said the project would eventually expand to include 20 to 25 new ships.
The first will be christened the USS Defiant, with the US leader personally involved in how it looks.
It comes as the US continues to build a large naval military presence near the coast of Venezuela. Since early September, it has struck more than 20 vessels in the Pacific Ocean and Caribbean Sea, which Mr Trump says is to crack down on drug cartels.
The US Navy has also seized two oil tankers and is believed to be in “active pursuit” of a third, according to officials.
Donald Trump speaking about the Navy’s ‘Golden Fleet’. Pic: Reuters
“There’s never been anything like these ships. These have been under design consideration for a long time,” he said.
“Each one of these will be the largest battleship in the history of our country. The largest battleship in the history of the world.
“We haven’t built a battleship since 1994. These cutting-edge vessels will be some of the most lethal surface warfare ships… other than our submarines.”
Mr Trump made the announcement at his Mar-a-Lago estate in Florida. During the briefing, he stood next to mock-up pictures of the new vessels which had “Trump Class” written in the corner – what a senior administration official said the new class of vessel will be known as.
Images of the new ‘Trump Class’ battleship. Pic: Reuters
In addition to the new battleship class, the project aims to increase the number of other types of war vessels, including a smaller, more nimble frigate class.
The term battleship has historically referred to a large, heavily armoured vessel armed with guns designed to bombard other ships or targets ashore.
This type of ship reached peak prominence during the Second World War. The largest of the US battleships was the Iowa-class.
Pic: Reuters
The Trump administration has been complaining about the slow and expensive state of the current defence industry.
Just a month ago, the Navy scrapped its plans to build a new, small warship, citing growing delays and overrunning costs. It has also failed to build its other newly designed ships, like the new Ford-class aircraft carrier and Columbia-class submarines, on time and on budget.
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But Mr Trump said the naval expansion would also be paired with renewed pressure on defence contractors to speed up production and rein in costs.
He said he plans to meet with major firms next week to address problems.
Barry Manilow is being treated for lung cancer and has been forced to reschedule live shows, the 82 year-old has revealed.
The Copacabana popstar announced on Instagram that a cancerous spot had been discovered on his left lung.
“As many of you know I recently went through six weeks of bronchitis followed by a relapse of another five weeks,” he wrote.
“Even though I was over the bronchitis and back on stage at the Westgate Las Vegas, my wonderful doctor ordered an MRI just to make sure that everything was OK.
“The MRI discovered a cancerous spot on my left lung that needs to be removed.”
Manilow, 82, added that the cancer had been found early thanks to “pure luck” and a “great doctor”.
And while he would not require chemotherapy or radiation treatment, he wrote, he would have to undergo surgery, forcing him to reschedule his January shows.
He had been due to embark on a string of arena concerts in US cities including Orlando, Tampa, Charleston, Greensboro and Columbus.
He wrote: “I’m going into surgery to have the spot removed. The doctors do not believe it has spread and I’m taking tests to confirm their diagnosis.
“The only follow-up is a month to recover and that means we have to reschedule the January arena concerts.
“I’m very sorry that you have to change your plans.
“Just like you, we were all looking forward to the January shows and hate having to move everything around.”
Barry Manilow poses for photographers ahead of a run of shows on Broadway in New York City in 2019. Pic: Reuters
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The Grammy Award-winning singer has released a string of hits over the course of more than 50 years recording music.
They include Could It Be Magic, Looks Like We Made It, Mandy, and Can’t Smile Without You.
His announcement comes after Cliff Richard revealed he had been treated for prostate cancer.
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